TR> These are rules of convenience required by the premise that there
TR> can be only a single Immortal remaining. Implicitly, because of
TR> this premise, there must be a finite number of Immortals. The one
TR> in a million number was also set arbitrarily. There is no
TR> explanation in story terms for either of these things.
Gee, isn't that last line what I have been saying?
BK>> There is no explanation how anyone can outfight an immortal who has
BK>> even one kill.
TR> Luck and skill have their place. Duncan trains constantly, has
TR> had, as you mentioned, four hundred years of practice, and has
TR> made close to eighty kills (as shown on the series). Methos, on
TR> the other hand, hardly ever practices, has had one kill in the
TR> last 250 years, but has 5,000+ years of accumulated power to his
TR> credit. The two are virtually equal in fighting skill.
Gaining all of a person's power would increase your power by the total of
your oppent's kills plus his original power. IOW, Kill someone with 80
kills any you become a minimum 81 times as powerful as someone with no
kills. You are talking unbeatable there. No combination of training or
luck could outweigh that. If the average of those 80 kills had 2 kills
that's 240 times. Three for each of the eighty. He should explode from all
that power. Maybe he can take Dean Caine's place as superman.
BK>> There is no explanation how the final victor will aquire powers no
BK>> immortal currently displays. Where would this new power come from
BK>> simply because there are no other immortals?
TR> It's magic. Live with it.
It's silly, dump it.
BK>> Some immortals will die anyway at the hands of the normal humans.
BK>> Beheading has long been a method of execution. If you cut someone's
BK>> head off it doesn't matter who did it, he's dead. If that were not
BK>> true then the episode where the mentally retarded immortal commits
BK>> suicide by putting his head on the train track would not work.
BK>> How will these normal induced deaths affect the final outcome.
TR> They won't. The last remaining get's the Prize. It doesn't
TR> matter how he becomes the last.
Again, it's silly.
BK>> Withoug rational explanations all this becomes simply magic. If
BK>> you're going to allow magic, why not magicians, wizards and warlocks
BK>> and witches? Why not dragons and goblins, and just turn the whole
BK>> series into something completely different?
TR> Because that's not what the series is about. Or has this just slid
TR> past your capabilities to comprehend.
Has proper discourse slid past your ability to control yourself?
If the show is based on magic, then it should open with a commentator
explaining that it is based in an alternate universe where magic works.
*Magic does not work in the real world.*
Bob Klahn
* Silver Xpress V4.02B03 RB10275
--- FLAME v1.1
* Origin: Telnet toltbbs.com or call 313-854-6001, Boardwatch #55 (1:234/2)
Ä [20] SFFAN (2:463/2.5) ÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄ SFFAN Ä
Msg : 110 of 233
From : Bob Klahn 1:234/2 .˙ō 03 .āé 96 15:25
To : Terry Riley
Subj : HIGHLANDER NEWS!
ÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄ
BK>> Why would immortals stop being born in 1980?
TR> According to Joe Dawson in the episode in which a girl claimed Richie
TR> was the father of her child, no immortal has ever had a child.
TR> This would suggest to me that the gene which produces immortals is
TR> recessive. When it crops up and produces an immortal, it is not
TR> transmitted to future generations. Eventually, the gene would cease to
TR> exist, except in the form of living immortals. 1980 is as good a time
TR> as any for the last gene to produce the last immortal.
A reasonable explanation, however, the immortals involved would not know
this. Also, if the gene is simply recessive, it may still continue for a
long time, esp if it's linked to something of value. Just as Sickle Cell
is linked to a resistance to malaria.
Of course, mules are very seldom fertile, and they are a cross between two
different, though related, animals. Maybe the immortals are actually the
product of a cross between humans and some other species long ago.
Bob Klahn
... WINDowError:001 Windows loaded. System in danger.
* Silver Xpress V4.02B03 RB10275
--- FLAME v1.1
* Origin: Telnet toltbbs.com or call 313-854-6001, Boardwatch #55 (1:234/2)
Ä [20] SFFAN (2:463/2.5) ÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄ SFFAN Ä
Msg : 111 of 233
From : Bob Klahn 1:234/2 .ķá 04 .āé 96 19:42
To : Eric Fishbein
Subj : EDUCATION THROUGH FIC
ÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄ
>> I would argue that the entire Star Trek series represents a decline
>> in
>> educational standards. The lack of valid scientific basis for much
>> of
>> anything is the basis for my saying this. I'd like to see real
>> scientific
>> knowledge extrapolated to the future.
EF> So you don't let your kids read any science fiction? The whole
EF> idea of sci-fi is anything that takes place in the future. How
How you reach that conclusion is beyond me. Saying ST lacks scientific
accuracy equates to rejecting all SF? I don't think so. I even let my kids
watch ST. I just wish it was better.
EF> you can prove anything 400 years from now will actually be
EF> based on ANYTHING even similar to today's science is beyond me.
You can't. You can, however, do the best you can. If you take all the
rules off you have the most outrageous fantasy. Not bad if it's done well,
but it's not SF.
EF> Star Trek is good for the immagination, and its one of the few
EF> shows on TV that actually has some moral standards, unlike most
EF> other TV which is pure, unadulterated CRAP. ST is really big
Moral standards? Don't you recall all those shows with crewmembers and
guests bedhopping? Worf and Alexander's mother mated, but did not marry.
She rejected marriage.
The "Prime Directive," in it's ST incarnation, is one of the most amoral
things I can think of.
EF> in other countries, including India for just these reasons, it
EF> makes you think. Ask some of the guys in NASA what was one of
EF> their inspirations in getting involved with the space program,
EF> and 2:1 they'll probably give Star Trek as one of them. Not
EF> bad for a show not based on fact...
Sure, it got them in. And for those who went on to careers in science it
led them to further knowledge. For those who didn't, there was just the
residue of mis-information. The original series had an excuse, I expect
improvement as time goes on.
BTW, making complaints like this is one big way those improvements are
encouraged. Let them know people care.
Bob Klahn
... Only those who attempt the absurd achieve the impossible.
* Silver Xpress V4.02B03 RB10275
--- FLAME v1.1
* Origin: Telnet toltbbs.com or call 313-854-6001, Boardwatch #55 (1:234/2)
Ä [20] SFFAN (2:463/2.5) ÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄ SFFAN Ä
Msg : 112 of 233
From : Bob Klahn 1:234/2 .ķá 04 .āé 96 19:42
To : Frank Glover
Subj : SOFT/SLAVER WEAPON
ÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄ
BK>> LED> I thought Niven might finally succumb to a backstory about
BK>> the
BK>> LED> origins of the Puppeter race with some explanation about why
BK>> the
BK>> LED> Puppeters were so timid.
FG> Some of the new fill material between the stories in the Crashlander
FG> collection addresses some of these points. If you (and Niven) accept the
FG> Man-Kzin Wars stories as part of his continuity, Mark O. Martin and Greg
Your message was addressed to me, but you only replied to LED's part of
the msg.
No biggie, but incase you missed it...
Bob Klahn
... Do still life on your computer -- run WinDOZE..
* Silver Xpress V4.02B03 RB10275
--- FLAME v1.1
* Origin: Telnet toltbbs.com or call 313-854-6001, Boardwatch #55 (1:234/2)
Ä [20] SFFAN (2:463/2.5) ÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄ SFFAN Ä
Msg : 113 of 233
From : Bob Klahn 1:234/2 .ķá 04 .āé 96 19:42
To : Eric Fishbein
Subj : VOYAGER DOC?
ÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄ
EF> Strange, after seeing a great B5 episode about "Camelot" the
EF> week of Jackie O's auction, and then watching a really lame
EF> Voyager a day later, I know which show now holds the higher
EF> social status.
That was a bad episode for B5, yet it was still a pretty good show. A good
episode is great.
Bob Klahn
... General failure reading drive A: Please remove your fist.
* Silver Xpress V4.02B03 RB10275
--- FLAME v1.1
* Origin: Telnet toltbbs.com or call 313-854-6001, Boardwatch #55 (1:234/2)
Ä [20] SFFAN (2:463/2.5) ÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄ SFFAN Ä
Msg : 114 of 233
From : Bob Klahn 1:234/2 .ķá 04 .āé 96 19:42
To : Frank Glover
Subj : STAR TREK GENERATIONS
ÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄ
EF>> That brings up another question: Did Data actually have a toilet
EF>> in his quarters?
FG> But I have to assume that Data was given conventional quarters, and
On a ship like the Enterprise their would be no reason for conventional
quarters. I suspect every room could be customized.
FG> simply never used it. (Guests might always need it, after all.)
This is an excellent point. It would suit Data's character to want to
avoid inconveniencing his guests.
Bob Klahn
... "No more experimental surgery for me," Tom said half-heartedly.
* Silver Xpress V4.02B03 RB10275
--- FLAME v1.1
* Origin: Telnet toltbbs.com or call 313-854-6001, Boardwatch #55 (1:234/2)
Ä [20] SFFAN (2:463/2.5) ÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄ SFFAN Ä
Msg : 115 of 233
From : Bob Klahn 1:234/2 .ķá 04 .āé 96 19:44
To : Bill Clements
Subj : EDUCATION THROUGH FIC
ÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄ
BC> From the desk of a cynical old man...
BC>
BC> Posted 28 Apr 96 - BOB KLAHN to BILL CLEMENTS
BC>
BK>> I'm willing to bet you can't make a valid case for declining
BK>> educational standards in the US at all. I've heard this over and over
BK>> and never seen the evidence presented. It's always some study
BK>> somebody did, but no supporting data provided.
BC> The case was made 16 years ago when Robert A. Heinlein addressed
BC> the Decline of Education in "EXPANDED UNIVERSE". I suggest that
...
BC> office. I do have proof, on file right in this room. I started
BC> clipping and filing by categories on trends as early as 1930 and
BC> my "youngest" file was started in 1945.
BC> I sincerely doubt that, upon her husbands death, Virginia
BC> Heinlein destroyed the aforementioned evidence. As she is
BC> renewing copyrights and keeping his work in publication, I am
BC> sure that she can be contacted through her publisher.
Please do so, I wish those who support that point of view would produce
the evidence. Reminds me of the 2000 yr old quote on the decline of
standards.
...
BC> There is not now nor has there ever been any _GOOD_(hard)_
BC> science fiction on television. (That should get me some hate
